Tup's Fade
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- William Anderson
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Re: Tup's Fade
hmm. I would never put up an argument for any anatomic attribute over any other, when there are so many other things to consider. At this point my instinct is to say..."Carl, you're right. That's a damn nice fly and a cool technique. It reminds us why so many tiers focus on tying wingless wets with the underbody as a significant factor. Thanks." It would end there with an appreciation for your sharing another interesting technique for these suggestive flies.
But. You posted an ento pic to support your position which seems unfair as a picture is a more powerful persuader than language.
It seems...many nymphs captured and photographed are not usually at the hatch-ready phase where their wing cases would become a prominent feature. Again, I'm simply riding on the shoulder of someone who is playing devil's advocate and put little faith in any single attribute. I'm quite happy with flies striving for some physical imitation or ignoring physical imitation in preference of vitality. However, wingless wets, unless weighted, are presented fairly high in the water column and if tied to represent an emerging or hatching nymph, would possess a dark/darkened wing case, in some cases. In terms of imitating naturals, I think you've hit on the same point as accentuating the underbody. In terms of the pics found online of nymphs...I think they make a very strong argument for the use of game birds. The legs, tails, buggy bodies. It is no wonder grouse, partridge and woodcock were so often used in tying the spiders. I don't think I even tie many flies with a discernibly darker thorax, but I usually look for contrast and vitality, and your representation here has that in spades. It's a damn nice fly. Thanks.
w
But. You posted an ento pic to support your position which seems unfair as a picture is a more powerful persuader than language.
It seems...many nymphs captured and photographed are not usually at the hatch-ready phase where their wing cases would become a prominent feature. Again, I'm simply riding on the shoulder of someone who is playing devil's advocate and put little faith in any single attribute. I'm quite happy with flies striving for some physical imitation or ignoring physical imitation in preference of vitality. However, wingless wets, unless weighted, are presented fairly high in the water column and if tied to represent an emerging or hatching nymph, would possess a dark/darkened wing case, in some cases. In terms of imitating naturals, I think you've hit on the same point as accentuating the underbody. In terms of the pics found online of nymphs...I think they make a very strong argument for the use of game birds. The legs, tails, buggy bodies. It is no wonder grouse, partridge and woodcock were so often used in tying the spiders. I don't think I even tie many flies with a discernibly darker thorax, but I usually look for contrast and vitality, and your representation here has that in spades. It's a damn nice fly. Thanks.
w
"A man should not try to eliminate his complexes, but rather come into accord with them. They are ultimately what directs his conduct in the world." Sigmund Freud.
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Re: Tup's Fade
...and I agree, an emerging insect will often have the darkened wing pads which are conspiquous. However we don't have wings on wingless wets. So an "imitation" should incorporate this somehow for it is distinct enough I believe. Your picture is a little deceiving on the overall appearance. The wings are dark but the perspective is from the top. A perspective from the bottom or side profile will show a much different color pattern with very little contrast with the dark pad showing to be nearly a mottle of color or from the underneath nearly not visible at all. Even looking at your photo there is actually quite a bit of the abdomen color in the front third of the nymph. On a flymph style pattern how do we best mimic this if it is an imitation we are after? I believe it is with a thorax that is a darker shade the still incorporates the basic color scheme. Of course a wingless wet could still be tied with pheasant tail or turkey wing pad as in a hares ear nymph. This would start to blur the lines and I don't think would be in the nature of a flymph.
My picture was not meant to support my point as it would only be supported by looking at numerous in stream examples but only to show what I was after with the tups fade pattern.
As a side note, and a good topic for another post, part of what we are talking about here is distinguishing between "imitation" of an insect with a limited pattern and "attracting" the trout's attention. The imitation doesn't necessarily have the greater attraction.
My picture was not meant to support my point as it would only be supported by looking at numerous in stream examples but only to show what I was after with the tups fade pattern.
As a side note, and a good topic for another post, part of what we are talking about here is distinguishing between "imitation" of an insect with a limited pattern and "attracting" the trout's attention. The imitation doesn't necessarily have the greater attraction.
I hate it when I think I'm buying organic vegetables, and when I get home I discover they are just regular donuts.
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Re: Tup's Fade
You guys are so far ahead of me with the different nuances in you tying, it's like I am a child in grade 1 but am sitting in a class of PHD's. I congratulate Carl and the rest of you who have such skills and knowledge. If I can acquire enough knowledge to tie some of the classics correctly, I will be satisfied especially if the trout and salmon agree. Thank you for sharing your knowledge, suggestions and opinions.
All the best,
Tim
https://www.flickr.com/photos/44673530@N04/
The measure of a man is not how many times he gets knocked down, but how many times he gets back up.
Tim
https://www.flickr.com/photos/44673530@N04/
The measure of a man is not how many times he gets knocked down, but how many times he gets back up.
Re: Tup's Fade
Don't take it too seriously Tim. Most of it is rambling personal opinion and hypothesis...
I hate it when I think I'm buying organic vegetables, and when I get home I discover they are just regular donuts.
http://www.oldhatflytying.com
http://www.oldhatflytying.com
Re: Tup's Fade
thanks, Carl, but what I said is absolutely true, you chaps are very knowledgeable and skilled.
All the best,
Tim
https://www.flickr.com/photos/44673530@N04/
The measure of a man is not how many times he gets knocked down, but how many times he gets back up.
Tim
https://www.flickr.com/photos/44673530@N04/
The measure of a man is not how many times he gets knocked down, but how many times he gets back up.
- William Anderson
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Re: Tup's Fade
True enough, but it's not hard to recognize an exceptional fly when you see one. This fade series really is very cool.Old Hat wrote: Don't take it too seriously Tim. Most of it is rambling personal opinion and hypothesis...
"A man should not try to eliminate his complexes, but rather come into accord with them. They are ultimately what directs his conduct in the world." Sigmund Freud.
www.WilliamsFavorite.com
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- fly_fischa
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Re: Tup's Fade
Yummy looking series of ties Carl, perfectly executed as always.
Love the hypothesising banter between likeminded tying nerds
I hear you about the cheating/deviation from a flymph by adding a wingcase to a tied in the round wingless wet/flymph. I can't help but think about this dilemma and wonder about the effect of an accidental drop (of the right viscosity) of head cement placed on top of the buggy thorax (somehow managing to avoid the abdomen and hackle ) pushed down on with a finger or thumb. This devious accident could potentially result in a darker wingcase without tying additional bits in. The only additional problem to contemplate besides potentially not making it to flymph heaven for having the thought to begin with is how to make the wingcase pronounced/humped, I might start using uv glue as head cement.
I hope I'm not banned for my impure thoughts
Love the hypothesising banter between likeminded tying nerds
I hear you about the cheating/deviation from a flymph by adding a wingcase to a tied in the round wingless wet/flymph. I can't help but think about this dilemma and wonder about the effect of an accidental drop (of the right viscosity) of head cement placed on top of the buggy thorax (somehow managing to avoid the abdomen and hackle ) pushed down on with a finger or thumb. This devious accident could potentially result in a darker wingcase without tying additional bits in. The only additional problem to contemplate besides potentially not making it to flymph heaven for having the thought to begin with is how to make the wingcase pronounced/humped, I might start using uv glue as head cement.
I hope I'm not banned for my impure thoughts
Re: Tup's Fade
Geez Karsten, might as well just trim the top hackles off and set your UV cement. Add a bead head while you are at it.
All in fun...not a bad idea actually...a Flymphy Nymph...
All in fun...not a bad idea actually...a Flymphy Nymph...
I hate it when I think I'm buying organic vegetables, and when I get home I discover they are just regular donuts.
http://www.oldhatflytying.com
http://www.oldhatflytying.com
- fly_fischa
- Posts: 604
- Joined: Sun Nov 08, 2009 9:01 pm
- Location: Melbourne Australia
Re: Tup's Fade
It took a lot of restraint not to mention the trimming and addition of a bead. You're a mind reader Carl, I was thinking of a rainbow coloured faceted bead to be exactmight as well just trim the top hackles off and set your UV cement. Add a bead head while you are at it.
K
- letumgo
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Re: Tup's Fade
Deviants!
Ray (letumgo)----<°))))))><
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