Don't shoot the messenger

[Soft-hackle]

Bill, I understand what you are saying, however, everyone should realize that each of us has a different perspective on what we do and why we do it. Sharing information like this adds to a fly fisher's insight. Just my train of thought.

Mark

[tie2fish]

Mark ~ The "different perspective(s)" of those of you who practice the upstream dead-drift technique is exactly what I would like to see discussed here. I know that your limited energy situation may not allow you to present a discourse, but it is the knowledge and experience of others like you that I seek.

[DUBBN]

I am kind of lost here. Is the "Upstream dead drift" with weight, like nymphing? Is it a drag free drift like a dry fly, except using a Flymph? Terminology plays a big part in the communication break down aswell. Maybe I will visit YouTube for a place to referance. Heck maybe I am the world champion at "Upstream dead drift", but I call it something else. If it is code for drinking your beer and not replacing it? Then I am one of the elite in the world.

[Izaak]

When I fish a wet, spider, flymph, etc. upstream it is usually to rising or porpoising fish in a larger river, or to fishy looking pools and riffles in smaller streams where I know fish are present, either from their rising or from personal knowledge of the stream and its fish. I will often put floatant on my leader in order to see the leader straighten out on the water ahead of me signaling a take from a fish. At other times I will first see a leaping trout and then feel the line go tight, or vice versa! When I see fish taking insects from the surface I will sometimes put floatant on the fly as well. I do not put floatant on the last 2-3 feet of tippet however.

[tie2fish]

When I fish a wet, spider, flymph, etc. upstream it is usually to rising or porpoising fish in a larger river, or to fishy looking pools and riffles in smaller streams where I know fish are present, either from their rising or from personal knowledge of the stream and its fish. I will often put floatant on my leader in order to see the leader straighten out on the water ahead of me signaling a take from a fish. At other times I will first see a leaping trout and then feel the line go tight, or vice versa! When I see fish taking insects from the surface I will sometimes put floatant on the fly as well. I do not put floatant on the last 2-3 feet of tippet however.

Now that is just the kind of helpful information I am looking for. Do any other members use the same criteria or technique? What does one do if rising or porpoising fish are not evident? Also, I have seen many members state that they do not weight either their flies or the tippet; how do you folks fish deep, heavy water?

[DUBBN]

When I fish a wet, spider, flymph, etc. upstream it is usually to rising or porpoising fish in a larger river, or to fishy looking pools and riffles in smaller streams where I know fish are present, either from their rising or from personal knowledge of the stream and its fish. I will often put floatant on my leader in order to see the leader straighten out on the water ahead of me signaling a take from a fish. At other times I will first see a leaping trout and then feel the line go tight, or vice versa! When I see fish taking insects from the surface I will sometimes put floatant on the fly as well. I do not put floatant on the last 2-3 feet of tippet however.

I have become so VERY lazy in my fishing over the years. I use to grease my leader aswell. The difference is, I would grease all but the last 18 inches of tippet. Perhaps I missed fish as I did not use an indicator, but I "think" the patterns were just a few inches under the surface. A bulge in the water let me know when I had a strike. With just a little practice, I always knew precisely where my patterns were. Even in windy conditions I could make out the bulge in the water letting me know my fly had been taken. I wonder if I have lost that skill. I have become so enthralled with floating in my raft that I have vurtually given up the finer points of wet fly fishing. Time to remedy that.

[hankaye]

Howdy All;

I'm perplexed ... nothing to be alarmed about... pretty much my
normal state of mind.....
I can understand the upstream cast and the dead drift downstream
concept. Water flows downstream or at least that is the theory, right?
What I have a hard time with or rather a difficulty in understanding
is the Downstream cast. Ok, there it is ..... It's not going to float itself
back upstream to me, so, what do the heck do ya do with it???
On a still water, I understand the concept of 'working' a fly to
induce a take. Do you do the same thing for a downstream cast? How does
one make something that, in all likely hood resembles a soaking wet cat in
a wind tunnel look like it would make a tasty morsel???
Befuddled in the middle of a desert ...

hank

[redietz]

I am kind of lost here. Is the "Upstream dead drift" with weight, like nymphing? Is it a drag free drift like a dry fly, except using a Flymph?

In the context of this board, it's the more of the latter. The traditional technique is done with a short line, kind of like Euro-nymphing, except in the film.

If I add weight to a wingless wet (which I seldom do), I refer to it as nymphing, and may use a strike indicator.

A hundred and fifty years ago or so, before there was such a thing a a fly fishing purist, the used flies if the fish were feeding in the upper part of the column, worms if they were feeding on bottom, and live minnows if they were feeding mid-column. I follow pretty much the same procedure, except that I use streamers for mid-column, and nymphs for on bottom. (Soft hackles make fine nymphs). Wets are reserved for fish feeding near the top.

Although I'm a big proponent of the upstream approach, there are times when the downstream swing is more productive. Caddis activity was mentioned somewhere above, and I would add winter stoneflies to that. Also, some mayflies are active swimmers (iso's and baetis for example) and the swing sometimes works better there, too.

If you're not comfortable with the upstream approach, just make your top dropper a dry fly, and fish it as usual.

[DUBBN]

redietz, I may have to try this adding weight to the wingless wet and fishing it as a nymph. May have merit.

[Ron Eagle Elk]

Howdy All;
What I have a hard time with or rather a difficulty in understanding
is the Downstream cast. Ok, there it is ..... It's not going to float itself
back upstream to me, so, what do the heck do ya do with it???
On a still water, I understand the concept of 'working' a fly to
induce a take. Do you do the same thing for a downstream cast? How does
one make something that, in all likely hood resembles a soaking wet cat in
a wind tunnel look like it would make a tasty morsel???
Befuddled in the middle of a desert ...

hank

hank,

I think (gonna get in trouble doing that) most think of the downstream cast as an across and down cast, allowing the fly to swing across the current on a tight line. This can be an effective technique and I have used it often fishing for steelhead. You can also cast across and downstream, then mend your line to get a dead drift before the line eventually tightens up and the swing begins. You can work the fly at almost any time during the drift or swing to induce a take. I have had a lot of fish hit a fly when it's sitting on "the dangle", after it has finished the swing and is just laying in the current directly down stream of the fisherman. You can also just allow the line to drift down under bushes and other overhanging obstructions to fish water that is often overlooked.

Did that muddy the water for ya?