Translucent Colour

[Mike Connor]

Mike,
Iksnay on the orange-ay .
Jim

My Latin was never very good, and I have terrible trouble interpreting pig-latin. Doubtless innate ineptitude, so you will have to translate that for me. Pig-latin also varies a great deal from place to place making interpretation even more uncertain.

I think what you wrote translates roughly as "nix on the orange", but I wouldn't bet on it. So it would be better for me if you used more or less "normal" English ( as far as an American is capable of such! ) in this case.

TL
MC

[Jim Slattery]

You can bet on it Mike!
You aints gots to no worry abouts your translations

[overmywaders]

hank,

Okay.
Then might I say that the suspended pigments in the water will act as an optical filter; depending on the depth and density of particles. We all know how colors are lost in water by depth, starting with red and then going through the visible spectrum with violet last (ROYGBIV). However, this optical filter of, perhaps, tannin can alter that by blocking out its opposing color. So, your fly may appear a different color based upon the depth fished and the particulates in the water. However, as others mentioned, what the water does to the artificial, it also does to the natural...

except, that the natural doesn't alter its color based upon translucence. I haven't read all the threads on the site about translucence, but certain fly materials react differently to water. For example, natural silk floss becomes almost transparent when fully saturated; while synthetics vary and also vary on the speed of water absorption. So, your first cast, the fly may not appear the same as it will when it is fully saturated. (The early Pink Lady dry fly used pink silk floss which turned red when wet. Modern synthetic pink floss remains pink.)

As well, naturals have dark internal organs, while, for maximum translucence many tiers use white thread or white lacquer over the base thread. (If I were to say anything about UV light, I might mention that many light-colored nylon threads really highlight dubbed bodies. But you didn't hear that from me.)

There is also the oil situation. The early Plains settlers had no glass for their windows, so they would put up well-oiled paper instead, because oil increases the translucence remarkably. Ask any woodworker as well. So, applying oil, as Dunne did, may give a different effect than simply saturating with water.

Regards,
Reed

[Mike Connor]

Explains some things quite well;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transparen ... anslucency

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turbidity

TL
MC

[hankaye]

overmywaders, Howdy;

I am curious, when you are testing any of your theories, if the water that you use is clear,
stained, or what and why do you choose what you do.

hank

[hankaye]

Mike Connor, Howdy;

Thanks for the links.

hank

[overmywaders]

hank,

I suppose it depends upon what theories we are discussing -- I have millions of them.
If you mean the matters on light and filtering that I posted above, those are not theories, but simple facts of optics. I employ such principles in designing the UV bandpass camera filters that I sell to photographers, scientists, astronomers, etc. around the world. I also use these principles in designing and reformulating the UV camouflage (patented) for military use. No brag, just detailing application of knowledge.

Now, if you mean applying those principles to the flies and where do I test them, that is a different matter. Here in NH, the Granite State, our streams tend to be rocky, high-gradient, freestone streams. Very clear water, generally. Unfortunately, the bog ponds, and the streams flowing from them which would be colored, are inaccessible to me now. Heck, it can take me thirty minutes just to get sixty feet from my favorite pool to the trail. So, my days of chasing little streams up into the hills are, alas, gone.

I hope I answered your question.

Regards,
Reed

[DNicolson]

From the Oxford English Dictionary:-

Translucent - adjective, allowing, light to pass through partially, semi-transparent.

I have recently been looking at Spent Spinner patterns, nowt to do with wing-less wets,
never mind, and what seemed to be the attempts in the past was to use a clear (white)
horsehair or old photo celluloid strip over the body (1930s) or clear plastic strip (1950s)
to achieve this.
The Spent Spinner was thought to especially need this as it was translucent.
The Celluloid was recommended by Roger Woolley and the Plastic by John Reid in
"Clyde Style Flies".
I have been considering tying for the 'translucent' effect with one of the new UV resins,
I have been recommended to Deer Creek Diamond Hard
http://www.deercreek.co.uk/Diamond-Hard ... n-kit.html

I will try this idea out and show the results.
There is no reason why this should be confined to Spent Spinners.

By-the-way, I am not definately not getting involved in hair-splitting translucency,
I have better things to do, like dressing some flies!

[overmywaders]

Donald,

I wonder if you could use Wonder Wings spent as a lattice for your resin. It might save some weight and provide a veined effect.
see http://www.traditionalflies.com/index.php?wallywing

Best regards,
Reed

[Otter]

From the Oxford English Dictionary:-

Translucent - adjective, allowing, light to pass through partially, semi-transparent.

I have recently been looking at Spent Spinner patterns, nowt to do with wing-less wets,
never mind, and what seemed to be the attempts in the past was to use a clear (white)
horsehair or old photo celluloid strip over the body (1930s) or clear plastic strip (1950s)
to achieve this.
The Spent Spinner was thought to especially need this as it was translucent.
The Celluloid was recommended by Roger Woolley and the Plastic by John Reid in
"Clyde Style Flies".
I have been considering tying for the 'translucent' effect with one of the new UV resins,
I have been recommended to Deer Creek Diamond Hard
http://www.deercreek.co.uk/Diamond-Hard ... n-kit.html

I will try this idea out and show the results.
There is no reason why this should be confined to Spent Spinners.

By-the-way, I am not definately not getting involved in hair-splitting translucency,
I have better things to do, like dressing some flies!

Worth a try on the body donald after all its been used successfully on the english resevoirs for buzzer patterns but I suspect that any such use on wings you may find it a bugger to cast such a fly as its aerodynamics may not be in your favour. The other possible downside is that semi solid wings, the lighning fast brownies will spit it out faster than you can say Jock Scott.
Interesting to see if the body would be difficult to keep afloat.
Please let us know how you get on , as they say nothing ventured , nothing gained.

Personally I have found CDC to be quite effective winging on spent patterns, leader spinning is only slight and not a major issue - semi transparent and soft as butter - rarely rejected quickly after a take. Downside off course is that such flies have a limited lifespan but enough in the tank to take an acceptable number of trout.

Reed.
In my experience I have found that Wallywings, tied in the spent position, are also a little prone to leader spinning and like CDC also have a limited lifespan. Coating them in UV curable resin is likely to compound the leader spinning even further.

Whatever ones choice in pattern , whether for the Sherry Spinners or larger Mayfly ( Danica ) or other's , its one of lifes great pleasures to be on the lake or river during a fall of spent.

Good luck with your experiments donald.