FLYMPH FORUM

I have a couple of questions: 1) What is the difference between English and Hungarian Partridge? Does it really make a difference? Is one better suited to a certain pattern(s) than the other?, and 2) I'm looking for a 1x short dry fly hook. Daiichi markets one (#1310) but I can't find anybody that carries it. Kamasan makes an (their terminology) extra-short shank hook (B405), but is not more specific than that.

Appreciate any help. Thanks.

Aaron Hirschhorn

Hi Aaron,
I don't believe there is much difference, except for maybe some color variations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_Partridge

Therefore, if a dressing calls for English Partridge, I believe you could use what's called Hungarian partridge.

Try Joe Fox: http://www.dettetroutflies.com/node/223

If Joe doesn't have any, try here. http://www.madriveroutfitters.com/pc-27 ... -1310.aspx

Hope all is well with you, Aaron.

Mark

Thanks Mark. I'll give them a shot.
Be well.
Aaron

AaronH wrote:I have a couple of questions: 1) What is the difference between English and Hungarian Partridge? Does it really make a difference? Is one better suited to a certain pattern(s) than the other?, and 2) I'm looking for a 1x short dry fly hook. Daiichi markets one (#1310) but I can't find anybody that carries it. Kamasan makes an (their terminology) extra-short shank hook (B405), but is not more specific than that.

Appreciate any help. Thanks.

Aaron Hirschhorn

Aaron,
English Partridge has a more of a brown tinge to the feathers than either French or Hungarian. So if you were to tie say a Orange & Partridge, then the pattern calls for a brown partridge hackle which you will get from the English Partridge. the others are too grey.
As for hooks, you might look at the Varivas and Tiemco range also.

Hi Philip,
I have had Hungarian Partridge with brown feathers as well. if I'm not mistaken, these partridge are classified as the same bird, actually, a Grey Partridge, but under different names-Hungarian Partridge or "Hun", English Partridge, and I've heard it called the European Partridge as well.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_Partridge

Mark

Hi Aaron,
Yes there is a difference between English Brown Partridge and Hungarian Brown Partridge. Basically English pPartridge tends to have a Amber hue while the Hungarian tends to be darker, more brown if you will. Also you tend to get the "brown" color up the neck closer to the head with English Partridge. As for the hooks most of the major suppliers do not offer them.
Jim

AaronH wrote:Is one better suited to a certain pattern(s) than the other?, and 2) I'm looking for a 1x short dry fly hook. Daiichi markets one (#1310) but I can't find anybody that carries it. Kamasan makes an (their terminology) extra-short shank hook (B405), but is not more specific than that.

Aaron,

Tiemco makes the TMC921 which is a 1xs dry fly hook. An alternative would be to shoot for a wide gape std shank dry like the TMC100 or similar offerings from other manufacturers.

Aaron

Okay,
I expect to learn something from this thread.

AaronH wrote:I have a couple of questions: 1) What is the difference between English and Hungarian Partridge? Does it really make a difference? Is one better suited to a certain pattern(s) than the other?,

Note Aaron asks "Does it really make a difference" I''ll add to the question and ask if there are any patterns that specify English Partridge and Hungarian Partridge or can they, in fact be interchanged. To me, the color, brown or gray, is probably more important.

Thanks,
Mark

Deleted

Hi Mark,
Okay, however why is it some people tie Partridge and orange with a gray partridge, other with brown, and both work. HMMM!

Here's what Mr. Fogg has to say " The partridge is a rotund little bird, an orange-brown in general colour, with grey neck and underparts. It has chestnut barred flanks. There are, however, colour variations in some localities but from the fly-dresser's point of view they do not produce the kind of neurosis induced colour variations in a bird like the grouse.....Male and female birds are similar in colour and appearance which means the fly-dresser may well make use of either sex"

Mark