Long Staple Dubbing options?

[CreationBear]

A lot of food for thought on the board lately, but Mike's great article on "hare," especially, has me wondering: when working with a long fiber like hare guard-hair or seal, is there a point where you feel the need to break it down in a coffee grinder before getting it on (or "in") the thread? While I love "Leisenring-y" techniques (e.g. split-thread, dubbing loop, dubbing brush) I'm finding that inserting "long" dubbing perpendicularly to the thread makes for a chunky fly. I usually end up using a "noodle" of dubbing parallel to the thread or wire, then picking it out with a velcro brush once it's on the hook--an "okay" solution, but still a bit of a hair-ball.

Any rules of thumb that work for you?

[Old Hat]

No real rules of thumb. I have some wool that is prepped and dyed and ready to be spun. It dubs wonderfully, but you can pull out small bits and start spinning it in your fingers into a very strong rope, then use it for body material. For the most part, on longer material, when I want a thinner body, I will pinch dub onto one thread strand "parallel" as you say, then make that one strand of a dubbing loop, twist and wrap. Control the amount of twist and you can vary the thickness of the body.

[CreationBear]

Carl, Mike--thanks so much for the insights...you're really helping me clear up the mystery of why y'all's flies look so much better than mine. BTW, I think I'll tape Mike's quote

Flies with tightly rolled bodies tend to be poor fish catchers in my experience. "Fluffy", "spiky", "airy" and translucent bodies are invariably much better.

to my vise.

[kanutripr]

The "fluffy, spiky, airy" bodies trap air bubbles better and look more natural, plus they swim better. It's really cool to have a clear glass of water next to your tying area, drop a fly into it and see what the materials look like under water.


Vicki

[CreationBear]

Vicki-- After a couple of days at the vise, I actually so much the same...my wife thinks I'm daft, no doubt.

[kanutripr]

It's tough isn't it? What must regular folks think about us? We are so misunderstood! It's nice to have a group of like-minded folks we can sympathize with and in turn gain sympathy.


Vicki

[Otter]

Having spent years of tying with seals fur for lough style wets , sea trout and salmon flies I kinda got hoodwinked into believing that seals fur was an unsuitable material for river trout flies, that it was too coarse. Having gone through my small collection of seals fur I would have to agree that 80% of what I have is way too coarse to be be heavily used but my few experiments last season with some of the finer stuff were very positive and indeed one simple pattern of medium olive seals fur, gold rib and peacock herl head accounted for a very serious number of fish.

As a result in trying to achieve a few blends where the seals fur is too coarse I have resorted to adding some silk from some pearsalls marabou floss - pull it through a strip of velco a dozen or so times and you will have some nice very fine dubbing. I have used in small amounts in conjunction with hare body guards of varying shades and quite like the subtle shading achieved by combining the hare fur with this very fine silk . What the trout think of these mixes is a matter of conjecture but I have a sneaking suspicion that they well be a big improvement in some cases compared to what I have been using.

I'm sure I am not the only one when I say the more and more I use natural materials the more reluctant I beome to using synthetics and actively think about how I can replace them with natural - and I have a sneaking suspicion that in many cases the naturals do work much better in their appeal to the trout. Apart from that working with natural material is invariably more satisfying and challenging.

[mvendon]

I just wanted to add that the seal's fur that's available today, is no where near what used to be available years ago. They had all types, colors and varieties. Here's a quick pic of some dubbed on a size 16 hook to show just how fine some of it was. The thread is Bennichi 12/0.

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This one is just of some of the variety that you could get. The piece in the center towards the bottom of the pic is what I used for the dubbing.

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Regards,
Mark

[Otter]

Thats pretty tighly dubbed , looks quite fine.

There is a lot of rubbish around it seems, it never realy bothered me much on the lough flies i tied for sea trout on 8/10/12's on a 16 some it would look like rope.

[CreationBear]

Otter, Mark-- thanks for the replies...seal as a material was a revelation to me: now I know what you guys were talking about. (Of course, in typical newbie fashion, I have to have an excuse not to use it on every fly )