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Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:09 pm
by NedZeppelin
Talked to Charlie Collins yesterday about acquiring a supply of hen necks suitable for tying flymphs this winter. Great, great conversation. First on my list were the “blue” duns, light, medium, dark and rusty. He pretty much disabused me of the notion that blue dun hen hackles exist, except he allowed that at some point in the past Andalusian hens were sought after since their silver gray blue plumage was thought to represent the color of some mayfly wings in the Catskills. He was enthusiastic about his barred versions for flymphs. He was very helpful, and I am really looking forward to getting a bunch of hen necks across the spectrum needed for Hidy flymphs. I’ll post some photos of the lot when it arrives.
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:56 pm
by letumgo
Please do. I am interested in seeing the set. Did he indicate if the barred versions are dyed? Sounds very useful.
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 7:27 am
by Theroe
NedZeppelin wrote: ↑Wed Dec 11, 2019 8:09 pm
Talked to Charlie Collins yesterday about acquiring a supply of hen necks suitable for tying flymphs this winter. Great, great conversation. First on my list were the “blue” duns, light, medium, dark and rusty. He pretty much disabused me of the notion that blue dun hen hackles exist, except he allowed that at some point in the past Andalusian hens were sought after since their silver gray blue plumage was thought to represent the color of some mayfly wings in the Catskills. He was enthusiastic about his barred versions for flymphs. He was very helpful, and I am really looking forward to getting a bunch of hen necks across the spectrum needed for Hidy flymphs. I’ll post some photos of the lot when it arrives.
Sounds GREAT !! Charlie is a good guy......if anyone can help, he will. Plus his birds ARE top flight (no pun intended, i think
) Personally, I am not a big fan of barred feathers. While grizzle, red grizzle (now known as cree) and chinchilla all have their place in fly tying, i feel they are over sold. When I look closely at pelts from the 1940's to late 1960's, the barring is much more muted. Plus they are flecked !! A few in my possession are labelled "Dun Grizzle Fleck - these were purchased from the Winnie Dette in 1983. Maybe a vintage hackle thread in in order!!!!!
Also - call Jim Slattery.....Im sure he has something good.
Cant wait to see your pictures!
Dana
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 8:18 am
by Old Hat
I'm not sure there is a real need for a blue dun. A light, medium and dark dun would cover just about anything in that range. Add to that a rusty dun, furnace and a honey dun and you would be all set. Not sure I have ever seen a true un-dyed blue dun hackle. I've seen some light or medium duns that you might be able to convince someone they are blue dun but not something I think someone could consistently breed for.
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 9:11 am
by Variant
I have been using Charlie Collins hackle for years and never had a problem.
IMHO Charlie’s birds are the best value around.
Lou
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 9:17 am
by wsbailey
As an aside, Whiting is now raising their True Blue rooster.
https://growlermag.com/raising-hackles- ... y-fishing/
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Thu Dec 12, 2019 12:25 pm
by NedZeppelin
I got the impression that they are naturally barred. On his website he has a column of dyed necks and natural necks, and the barred hens we discussed were all natural.
I was asking about the blue dun as a rookie: almost every older recipe you see for flymphs and wets says “blue dun” so I had to ask. I have some blue dyed dry fly saddle hackles for small BWOs from Feather Emporium.
http://collinshacklefarm.com/Home.asp
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 8:12 am
by redietz
NedZeppelin wrote: ↑Thu Dec 12, 2019 12:25 pm
I was asking about the blue dun as a rookie: almost every older recipe you see for flymphs and wets says “blue dun” so I had to ask.
It's good to remember from time to time that the term "blue dun" comes from horse breeding and was used to distinguish a silver gray from a light brown (both of which are called dun when applied to horses.)
We no longer live in an agrarian society where everybody knows what color we're refering to when discussing barn yard animals. Just as you need to take the term "red" (from poultry breeding -- think Rhode Island Red) in older dressings with a grain of salt, you need to allow some leeway in what you mean by "blue" in blue dun.
This is a blue dun horse:
and this is a red rooster:
Personally, I would have called them gray and brown, but I didn't get to make up the names.
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Fri Dec 13, 2019 9:05 pm
by joaniebo
I have no idea what a "true" blue dun hackle might look like. But years ago, I bought several shades of "grey / gray" hen capes from the Feather Emporium (I know, lots of people do not like this company). By that, I mean what I woukd call "light, medium or darker" shades of the color. I've used them, as is, and also dyed individual hackles in turmeric to make shades of olive.
I have the same problem with "honey dun", which I've always thought was a feather with a grayish color tint near the stem with honey colored tips.
Re: Blue Dun Hen Hackle
Posted: Sat Dec 14, 2019 12:19 pm
by Variant
Color is very subjective in sporting nomenclature to say the least. IMHO color is a regional thing,there is no true standard.Whenever breeding takes place be it in horses, fowl and dogs colors change. Even in nature colors change,red phase ,grey phase and every thing in between for the ruffed grouse.British fowl color names vary from Spanish fowl color names. I just replaced an old blue grouse pelt, it is now called a dusky grouse and/or sooty grouse.Same bird different color names? When you see a unique color that strikes your eye buy it! You may never get the same color again.
Lou
